Subject: Re: On nil qua false [was: Re: On conditionals]
From: Erik Naggum <>
Date: Tue, 27 Nov 2001 16:10:44 GMT
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Message-ID: <>

* Andreas Bogk
| But I'm seeing a lot of "Common Lisp does it that way and you need to
| swallow it", and a lot of people who seem to have forgotten that
| Common Lisp is man-made (and even designed by a committee and full of
| bad compromises and legacy crap).

  So are the laws of any given country.  You do not break them because you
  object to them, you enter politics and obey the laws while you change
  them.  If you are the fucking clueless moron who breaks laws you do not
  like, you are nothing but a retarded criminal.  Why the criminal mind is
  so important to hold up as a role model for social change is beyond me.

| We folks from the Dylan community see ourselves as part of the Lisp
| community.

  You seem to be quite alone in this regard, especially considering your
  hang to insult other Lisp communites and waltz in with stupid concerns
  that simply are _not_ concerns except to outsiders.  As convicted felons
  protest their innocence, but would not improve unless they accepted that
  they are guilty and the fate of the guilty, any random outsider who does
  not accept that complaining about non-issues is stupid or the negative
  consequences of such actions, will never be part of that community.

| We're interested in an honest discussion on what the Right Thing is (and
| yes, Dylan has it's shortcomings too).

  A good start would be to accept the choices people have made.  Coming
  into a new community and accusing people of regarding their standards as
  "gospel" because you want to be a criminal in that community is not a
  good start.  Strive not to be an outsider.  Do _not_ see yourself as an
  outsider.  (There are no "insiders", but people who choose to regard
  themselves as if they are always doomed to stand outside and look in,
  have no hope of ever gaining any useful information about what they keep
  looking at and not understanding.  Part of relinquishing the "outsider"
  status is to accept that other people have accepted certain things, and
  that they are _not_wrong_ in doing so even if you think it is not right.
  In time, you will see the wisdom that there are more than one right, that
  the idea that there is "one right" is wrong, but that this does not mean
  that one cannot determine that something will always be wrong no matter
  what is right.)

  The past is not more important than the future, despite what your culture
  has taught you.  Your future observations, conclusions, and beliefs are
  more important to you than those in your past ever will be.  The world is
  changing so fast the balance between the past and the future has shifted.