Subject: Re: Why is Scheme not a Lisp?
From: Erik Naggum <>
Date: Fri, 15 Mar 2002 06:40:31 GMT
Newsgroups: comp.lang.lisp
Message-ID: <>

* Thomas Bushnell, BSG
| Except there hasn't been such "pathetic whining", except for your
| amazing diatribes.  It would be funny if it weren't so sad.

  I am saddened that you are so deep into denial that you cannot even see
  what you are doing.  Please seek help to get out your anger rut.  At the
  very least, take a break from this newsgroup for a couple weeks.  You are
  too wound up to be able to think unclouded by emotion, and this does you
  no good.  You need to learn to deal with both diversity of opinion and
  the adversity of rejection of your opinions.  I also suggest you talk to
  someone about how you cope with cognitive dissonance.  Quit lying about
  me and what I say, want, or intend, and there is no need for me to post
  any correctives to your lies, either.  Now is a good time for you to zoom
  out and think carefully about what you want.  In case it is not clear: I
  want you noise-polluting Scheme freaks out of here, because there is very
  strong evidence of a serious culture clash whenever any one of you have
  the bad taste to wander into this forum or cross-post here.  And please,
  it is not because we do not handle disagreement -- we have plenty of it
  -- it is because you cannot deal with us being right and you being wrong
  in this newsgroup even if you have always been patted on the back and got
  the best grades for what you parrot from another forum.  If technical
  issues matter, if decisions of language design are made on technical
  grounds, and if call-with-current-continuation is a technically superior
  idea, how come no other language has this construct?  Either you have to
  face that "technical" does nto matter, or that this feature is no good.
  That is a question you do not receive where everybody agrees it is the
  best thing since sliced bread and there is something wron with the rest
  of the world for not having it, but that agreement does not exist here.
  It is such things that make up the reasons for splitting a community.
  Again, it is not because people cannot handle disagreement, it is just
  that some things are supposed to be agreed upon in a community -- they
  are precisely what the community is based on, it is because people agree
  on these things even though they disagree on a lot of others that they
  have come together.  Even if people fight all the time for what they
  think is right, there is serious psychological value in coming home to
  someone who love you for who you are and not have to fight.  That is what
  normal people seek in a reasonable community -- a place where people
  agree with them on certain things.  For instance, if people have to fight
  for their desire to use Common Lisp all day long and they have to face
  stupid and prejudiced people who denigrate Lisp and make their lives so
  much less enjoyable, they would naturally want to come to comp.lang.lisp
  and find people who agree with them that Common Lisp is a great language
  -- but that is precisely what you fucking annoying Scheme freaks deny us,
  what those who have some idiotic gripe with the standard deny us, what
  those who post web pages whining about braindamaged conditionals deny us,
  etc.  There are just some decisions we have made, we agree on them and
  their outcome, and we do not want to fight that battle over and over and
  over just because some of those who have not made that decision and who
  have their own forum to feel safe and secure in, choose to invade us with
  a constant barrage of annoying attitude problems.  I find you stupid
  dorks incredibly inconsiderate and rude, and I respodn to your total lack
  of civility in storming a political party meaning, or a church, or an
  abortion clinic, or a radio or TV station, or a newsgroup, with an agenda
  that basically says: "You guys are all wrong, and we are going to convert
  you!"  Such idiotic wars is not what technical newsgroups are for.  If
  you Scheme freaks want this kind of forum, I suggest you create a new
  forum, comp.lang.lisp.advocacy, where fools can bash eachothers' heads
  in, while adults can explore the space that opens up before them because
  they are comfortable with having made a particular decision.

  (I made that all one paragraph so people who read only the first should
  not get away with skipping all the juicy bits.)

  In a fight against something, the fight has value, victory has none.
  In a fight for something, the fight is a loss, victory merely relief.